Directed by Ryan Ashley Lowery, Light Up is centered around five prolific figures of the Black queer community: Dunlap Simone, Derek Johnson, Benjamin Carlton, Obio Jones, and Octavius Terry. Over the course of the documentary Lowery, along with other interviewers, get into the nitty-gritty of the lives of the film’s subjects, how they learned that they were queer, the kind of push back they faced from society, and what did it take for them to overcome the hurdles placed in front of them and make a name for themselves in a profession of their choosing. Lowery sat down for a virtual chat with me to talk about the experience of making Light Up, what it was like to interview Simone, Johnson, Carlton, Jones, and Terry, representation of Black queer people in the world of entertainment, and more.
How did you come up with the idea of making Light Up?
“As a Black gay person, for a long time I didn’t really see a representation of myself in the media, which at times made me feel alone, different, and not seen. And as I got older, I began to see more representation of Black gay men, but they also weren’t a reflection of how I saw myself. They were often extremely flamboyant, which is part of the representation of Black gay men but not the full representation. We are not a monolith. I live by Mahatma Gandhi’s quote “Be the change you wish to see in the world”. Part of my impetus to create Light Up was to create a documentary that would provide a diverse set of positive role models for young Black queer people and to provide a documentary where queer people feel seen, heard, and loved. This was a love letter to me and other people in the queer community. I also wanted to create a documentary that promoted healing within the Black queer community as I can feel a lot of sadness, heaviness, and trauma in certain queer spaces. It can be difficult to be yourself in a world that at times can tell you being yourself is wrong and who you love is wrong. As Joseph Beam states “Black men loving Black men is the revolutionary act.””
The subjects of your interview are coming from various professional sectors. So, what was the process of getting them to take part in your film?
“Luckily, it wasn’t hard as I didn’t have to work to convince any of the subjects to be a part of Light Up. They all were open and willing to tell their stories with hopes of inspiring others. Several of the subjects were friends that trusted me with their story, so those conversations were easy. Other subjects were acquaintances with mutual respect and community. After having deeper conversations to get to know each other further, that led to more comfort and ultimately their participation in the documentary.”
What are some of the most educational things that you learned about the LGBTQ+ community from the interviews that were conducted for Light Up?
“The most educational thing I learned is how much education didn’t play a role in their full identities. At times, status and titles from education can be emphasized to be the only path forward, when in truth, it is often education that can hinder some of our gifts. Yes, there is a place for education, however, most of the film’s subjects charted their way despite their educational level. That, for me, was the real education. That no matter what education you have attained, our gifts don’t always need a certificate of accomplishment for them to be valid. Ultimately, sometimes you must figure out what your gifts are, then choose to be qualified in that field. And sometimes finding our gifts takes time; just don’t give up!”
What is the process of ensuring that your questions are not overwhelming for your interviewees while also allowing them to be vulnerable?
“Maurice Eckstein (the primary interviewer) researched each person’s lives as much as possible to get a greater understanding of them to allow us to be sensitive to each subject’s feelings and experiences. He really set the atmosphere when we got to the more serious part of the interviews. Maurice, Michael Richards (aka Michael’s Mixx – the host of the space and a secondary interviewer), and myself (a secondary interviewer) made sure we were present with our subjects and paid keen attention to their emotions as we asked questions and listened to their responses. Any time we felt an interviewee needed a moment we gave them that moment, and any time we felt the questions were getting too heavy we eased up towards lighter questions or switched topics. It was wonderful having all three of us working together because at times one of us sensed things that the other two of us didn’t sense so we were able to consult and pull back when we needed to. We developed a baseline of questions to guide us, but often, we just followed where the responses took us and let the documentary in instances tell its own story instead of what we may have previously envisioned for any one interviewee.”
You have used a lot of archival footage, stock footage & images, as well as painted images to underscore the stories of your interviewees. So, what was the thought process behind the use of so many different kinds of methods to visualize the backstories?
“My editor, Clinton Cornwell, and I wanted to utilize whatever medium that we thought best conveyed the backstories, so we did not limit ourselves to one method. In choosing each method, we made sure that the method was not one off and appeared at least hopefully a few times to create some form of repetition and get the intended audience comfortable with the method. We also wanted to have visual variety as we felt it would be helpful in keeping the audience’s attention in a world where attention spans can be limited.”
What was the editing process of Light Up like? How difficult is it to pick and choose which aspects of the interviewees’ life story you want to keep and which you want to leave on the cutting room floor?
“The editing process was extremely long and difficult. We interviewed more than 20 people for Light Up, which was supposed to start as a docuseries. We initially created rough edits of several 30 to 45 minute episodes but changed direction after receiving advice from some people in the documentary industry that it’s easier to sell an independent feature length documentary than an independent docuseries. We envision this version of the Light Up documentary as marketing for an introduction to what we will hopefully call Light Up docuseries. In choosing 5 of the more 20 subjects to highlight in our initial film it was challenging because we had to interweave connected but disparate stories into a cohesive film. Often, we had two or more subjects saying almost the same profound thing or having a very similar interesting experience. We wanted to keep both perspectives or experiences, but at the end of the day we had to choose the one that helped us tell the story the best or who had the most emotional impact. Sometimes, we managed to keep both to show commonality in stories and themes, but at other times we were intentional to show diversity in experiences. For instance, it was important for us to show a range of coming out stories as not everyone in the Black community is initially rejected by their family and friends. Some people have positive coming out stories yet experience other struggles with their sexuality because of the greater society.”
Your movie highlights a couple of queer films, especially due to your interviewees’ association with those films. So, what are some of your favorite films centered around people from the LGBTQ+ community?
“Noah’s Arc, Empire, P-Valley, Rustin, Lil Richard: I Am Everything, Pride FX, and Pose are a few of my favorite films and tv shows centered around people from the LGBTQ+ community.”
“Patrick-Ian Polk’s Noah’s Arc was the first time I remember seeing a diverse set of Black same gender loving men in an ensemble cast that in some ways all reminded me of myself and my circle friends which was very empowering. Jussie Smollett’s character, Jamal Lyon, on Empire was the first time I saw a Black gay man and other Black gay characters on mainstream TV that reflected how I view myself. Interestingly, my mother, who doesn’t watch much television herself, kept pushing me to watch Empire. She didn’t tell me why she wanted me to watch, but once I did, I quickly understood why – she wanted me to see “Jamal Lyon”. I called her immediately after watching and thanked her for encouraging me to watch as I was thrilled to see the character. This was also a reminder of the growth in her acceptance of my sexuality which she initially struggled with but thankfully she came around pretty quickly relative to others.”
What are the most significant changes in the entertainment industry that you’ve seen that have paved the way for films like Light Up?
“At the end of the day, the entertainment industry is a business. The entertainment industry has begun to see LGBTQ content as a valuable asset that people are interested in. We also have more openly queer people in industry leadership roles and creating content, as well as a greater appreciation for diversity, so all of these are drivers that have paved the way for films like Light Up.”
What changes do you wish to see in the entertainment industry so that we get to see more films like Light Up?
“I would like to see even more queer people as executives and key decision makers in the entertainment industry. I would also like to see even greater support from the queer community for queer artists and LGBTQ centered media. At certain times, it feels like we need mainstream to validate our artist and artistry before we do.”
And what kind of thoughts & opinions, overall, would you want audiences to walk away with after watching Light Up?
“I would like the audience, especially the queer audience, to walk away feeling loved, seen, and heard. I would like for non-queer people to develop a greater empathy and understanding of queer people. Overall, I want all the audience to leave the film feeling inspired and to understand the light we each bring to the world, in its most authentic form, is a superpower.”
